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The Serpent Forum Discussion of all things serpent. Please visit the serpent website www.serpentwebsite.com
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J.c. Sherman
Joined: 05 Mar 2007 Posts: 22 Location: Cleveland, USA
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Posted: Thu Mar 08, 2007 9:23 am Post subject: Leather Wrap |
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Okay, so I'm puzzled...
I always read that traditional serpents are "leather wrapped" or "wrapped in leather", excluding the shellacked canvas ones. What does that mean, exactly? Is there a seam? Does it run the length of the instrument like a sleave? Is it wrapped and glued, each wrap's edge abutting the previous?
Thanks in advance for any insite.
J.c.S. |
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paulschmidt
Joined: 04 Mar 2007 Posts: 44
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Posted: Mon Mar 12, 2007 9:39 am Post subject: leather wrapping explained |
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The traditional serpents, at least in the French tradition, did in fact use shrunk leather. I don't know the exact mechanism for putting it on, but I believe it involves attaching the leather in a moistened state, where it is more flexible, stretchable, and then it shrinks a bit when it dries, making a very tight fit over the wood, rather like a sausage casing! Shrinking the leather would also help take out some of the wrinkles where the leather might not have gone on perfectly. The tight leather adds an element of strength to the wooden structure, and of course it is a crucial feature in making the serpent air-tight.
Serpents with leather covering do in fact have a seam. Whoever did the leather for Christopher Monk did a beautiful job, and the seam is practically invisible. Some of the earlier ones produced after Christopher's death had a very noticable seam, but Keith Rogers (or his leather craftsman?) seems to have figured it out and the newer ones are much improved (still not invisible on the ones I have seen). The skin of a leather covered serpent is very important, rather like an animal's skin. And it certainly is more beautiful than the coarse look of painted / varnished serpents. When I show serpents after concerts and during presentations / recitals, the thing that most people seem to fixate on is the wood and leather construction. They always comment on how exotic and 'sensual' the combination seems to them. It is part of what makes a serpent interesting! _________________ Paul Schmidt
editor, Serpent Newsletter
webmaster, Serpentwebsite.com |
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J.c. Sherman
Joined: 05 Mar 2007 Posts: 22 Location: Cleveland, USA
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Posted: Thu Mar 15, 2007 12:50 pm Post subject: |
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So i glean that the seam runs the length of the instrument, correct?
J.c.S. |
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paulschmidt
Joined: 04 Mar 2007 Posts: 44
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Posted: Thu Mar 15, 2007 3:04 pm Post subject: More on leather wrap |
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Yes, I neglected to mention this...the leather appears to have a straight seam that runs down the length of the instrument, starting on the inside of the curve below the bocal receiver, and alternately being on the inside and outside of bends. In most places the seam is very hard to see. I imagine that it was feathered instead if simply butted. In other words, the first edge to be glued down may have been cut to an angle, rather like a shallow ramp from the wood up to the top surface of the leather, then the leather being wrapped around and glued flat up the ramp, then razor trimmed and possibly sanded or burnished somehow. This is often done with cork when being put onto joints of clarinets, etc. _________________ Paul Schmidt
editor, Serpent Newsletter
webmaster, Serpentwebsite.com |
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Russ Kaiser
Joined: 02 Mar 2007 Posts: 29 Location: Winston-Salem, NC
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Posted: Tue Mar 20, 2007 5:45 pm Post subject: |
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I recently went to one-piece fiberglass patterns (one piece per side per layer, that is) on my serpents and in developing that pattern I did a detailed study of covering the serpent shape using AutoCAD and good old geometry.
By molding in two halves, it is fairly easy to get a decent fit with the cloth because you are splitting all the trouble areas neatly in half. If you try to use just a single seam and place it where my left hand seams falls, the top half with all its tight curves is going to give you a fit. I'm not saying it can't be done, but I would urge anyone trying this to use a cheap fabric for mockup, maybe something like vinyl that will work a lot like leather.
To show you what I am talking about here is the projection of my serpent:
In contrast, here is the pattern I am using for covering one half of my instrument. This is in fact a little fat because I allow for flashing. Ultimately the curves straighten out a little and the radius of each curve increases.
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J.c. Sherman
Joined: 05 Mar 2007 Posts: 22 Location: Cleveland, USA
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Posted: Tue Mar 20, 2007 7:33 pm Post subject: |
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Interesting. I know about that curve shape; I use similar curves to make compound curved patches and tubes with sharp bends. I follow that, with adhesive and a good stitch, it would be a heck of a lot easier. But would it last as long and bind as well as the single stitch? Surely they would have thought to try it 200 years ago, especially as the instrument is made in halves. So I guess I would ask - why didn't they do it?
J.c.S. |
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Russ Kaiser
Joined: 02 Mar 2007 Posts: 29 Location: Winston-Salem, NC
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Posted: Tue Mar 20, 2007 8:10 pm Post subject: |
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| J.c. Sherman wrote: | it would be a heck of a lot easier. But would it last as long and bind as well as the single stitch? Surely they would have thought to try it 200 years ago, especially as the instrument is made in halves. So I guess I would ask - why didn't they do it?
J.c.S. |
I have not seen stiching on the leather covering any serpent, they typically have mitered butt joint running the length as Paul described earlier. I am assuming all the leather is glued to the wood, probably something slow setting so the leather dries at about the same rate that the glue does.
My friend Paul Horner had a terribly hard time covering his serpent, and had to make several cuts on the inside corners to remove excess. I would recommend buying the most supple hide you can find and you will have to stretch the puppies out of it. Uh Oh, I trigger the filth filter. Ha, the word I just used is the last name of a famous writer whose first name is Charles.
I would guess the biggest reason original makers tried to get the leather on in one piece is because it was supposed to seal all the other joints in the wood. From what I know, and Paul S. can correct me here if I am wrong, serpents made with from two monolithic pieces of wood with a center seam survived well, but probably did not constitute the majority of instruments made. Most were made out of several smaller pieces and so there were a lot of joints to cover. Many serpents have wrought iron staples driven into the wood accross these seams and would look like frankenstein if you removed the leather. I have a copy of a restoration disertation with some great photos of a couple such instruments.
Anyway, I know you are thinking about covering a serpent with leather and I just want to caution you to plan well ahead since you will have to buy an entire hide to do the job and you don't want to botch it. |
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paulschmidt
Joined: 04 Mar 2007 Posts: 44
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Posted: Tue Mar 27, 2007 6:03 am Post subject: more on leathering |
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Russ is correct. I also agree that fewer wood seams results in fewer critical places for leaks to happen as the instrument ages. However, it is my guess that a single leather seam is mostly cosmetic, even if it would help the leak issue. Hard to guess just what the makers had in mind. Christopher Monk repaired many old serpents that had been stapled together (this was even more common, and severe, with Military style serpents than with Church style), and I gathered from his comments that the staples usually failed due to rust, leaving weak joints and extra holes that can leak. Our modern reproductions, with high-tech glues, are probably going to last longer than the old ones. But then, some of those old hide glues were amazingly strong. _________________ Paul Schmidt
editor, Serpent Newsletter
webmaster, Serpentwebsite.com |
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Paul Horner
Joined: 02 Apr 2007 Posts: 11 Location: NC
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Posted: Mon Apr 02, 2007 7:56 pm Post subject: Leather wrap |
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| Covering a serpent? Good luck. When I built my Church Serpent, I did not really know how to go about covering it. My goal was to use one piece of leather and wind up with one seam going the length of the instrument on the back side. I bought a 1.5 ounce, black, split cow hide and a quart of Barge contact cement. I began covering it from the BIG end, cutting and gluing as I went. It wasn't long before some "interesting" cuts and gussetts were necessary. Anyway, after 3 evenings, I arrived at the bocal end. The seam(s) wound up to be mostly on the back side. The instrument has a seamless look when view from the front. If I build another serpent, I would do some things differently. I would skive (sp?) the joints, ie. cut on a bevel. I used butt joints originally. And, I would start at the bocal end. I think the leather would "follow" the instrument easier. I would buy the largest, biggest, and l o n g e s t hide I could find. In the case of my serpent, the leather was more for the original look and feel than sealing. It is glued together with Gorilla Glue, and has several coats of Danish Oil sloshed inside. No staples. My serpent is pictured on page 10 of the 27 Sept. 2004 Serpent Newsletter. |
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J.c. Sherman
Joined: 05 Mar 2007 Posts: 22 Location: Cleveland, USA
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Posted: Fri Jan 09, 2009 10:09 am Post subject: |
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| Russ Kaiser wrote: | I have a copy of a restoration disertation with some great photos of a couple such instruments.
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Where can I get a copy of that disertation? Sounds absolutely fascinating!
J.c. _________________ c:1840 9-key Ophicleide in C by Guichard (with added Ab Key).
http://sites.google.com/site/jackofallbrass/ |
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Gabe S
Joined: 30 Mar 2007 Posts: 33 Location: Yorktown, VA
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Posted: Fri Jan 09, 2009 3:01 pm Post subject: leather |
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My Monk (Rogers) D serpent has a single seam in the leather, but it is not on the inside/alternating outside edge of the curves. It is on the facing edge of the back. If you lay the horn down on it's back, the seam is touching the ground at all points. I've always been in awe of this, I always ask people that I play for if they can frigure out what shape the leather would have to be if it were flat!
Truly a masterful job! _________________ J. Gabriel Stone |
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